Wednesday, July 4, 2012

Listening to those opposed to AB 2109: Dawn Winkler


These were the instructions from the Chair:

The "Dawn" is Dawn Winkler, a long-time anti-vaccination activist, who is determined to defeat AB 2109

Dawn's "83 of 105" figure was from "research" was evidently done by Amy Templeton Helstrup. Evidently she called pediatric practices in a 30-mile radius of her zip code.  I'm not sure what she asked; I can imagine that you could phrase the question in such a way to get the scheduler to refuse.  So pediatric practices are refusing to take new families who are vaccine-refusers.



Yes, evidently Dawn lost a daughter to SIDS, which she insists is vaccine-induced.



HAPI is Health Advocacy in the Public Interest.  In 2004 they sent 4 vaccine syringes for testing to Doctor's Data, a notorious lab.  It's not clear to me that Doctor's Data is even competent to test vaccines.


I'm not sure what the next tweet is about.  Evidently the anti-vaccine forces proposed a number of amendments to the bill, but I can't find texts for them.

This was the end of Winkler's testimony.  Up next is the D-list actor, Rob Schneider


63 comments:

  1. Liz, what about Bill Gates variant polio in India now called NPFP? Twice as deadly. GSK recently been fined £3 Billion for fraud over drug efficacy data and Merck in court for fraud over Mumps vaccine fraud.

    On the surface your campaign looks noble but unfortunately you have bought into something that is nothing short of bullshit.

    How many flu scamdemics are we going to fund so the CDC can keep pretending we are all about to die. Vaccination is a middle ages myth and the stats are generated by non independant arseholes.

    I mean Billy boy has shares in the companies making the vaccines that are poisoning thousands. People like you are like those special sheep that lead flocks into the abattoir.

    ReplyDelete
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    1. Yes, India might stop the use of the trivalent polio vaccine. Now they're using the bivalent vaccine. So, you want India to have polio because you misunderstand how vaccines work? I'm glad that scientists are much smarter, better educated and work harder than your simplistic google searches. :)

      Obviously, you didn't read anything about GSK's troubles. First, it was 3 billion DOLLARS. But no problem, it's hard to get facts right when you're not really interested in facts. Not one of the criminal complaints was over drug efficacy. One complaints was over promoting off-label use, something that sales reps do in the pharmaceutical industry. Another was providing kickbacks to physicians. Another was lying about pricing data. All very bad. Very unethical. But nothing about efficacy.

      The Merck "mumps fraud" has not been proven in court, and the vaccine is still safe and efficacious. You're searching for stuff.

      You're kind of funny aren't you. No facts, just screaming loudly.

      Delete
    2. "Yes, India might stop the use of the trivalent polio vaccine. Now they're using the bivalent vaccine." Well that's a fuck up then, if they got it wrong massively the first time why should they get it right the next time? You guys are so believer in all this pro vaccine crap you can't even call time when they screw up!

      What did they baptise you with, Monsanto corn?

      Delete
    3. @ Anonymous: The NPFP (Non-Polio Flaccid Paralysis) that you refer to has been determined to be from other causes. You do know, don't you...that there are many causes of flaccid paralysis?

      India has not had a confirmed case of polio since January, 2011 and the YTD cases of polio worldwide stands at 121 cases:

      http://www.polioeradication.org/Dataandmonitoring/Poliothisweek.aspx

      Delete
    4. Psalm 42 chapter 3 looks like polio, smells like polio, tastes like polio good job they had the vaccine we can call it something else!

      Delete
    5. They are so into believer nonsense about vaccines being untouchable it's a waste of time even trying to discuss anything with them.

      Evidence stopped meaning anything a long time ago for these septic types, they all sit round having frigging sessions over medical peer review!

      Delete
    6. Nice to see Lilady has scuttled off back to lord Orac and co. there there luvvy. Wonder what the next septic strategy is going to be, playing the pretend anonymous didn't work for long.

      Delete
    7. 47,500 children became paralyzed after polio vaccinations in India in 2011. According to Dr Jacob a member of the national technical advisory group on immunization and of the working group on the food and drug regulation in 2011 after receiving the polio vaccination, an additional 47,500 children were newly paralyzed, over and above the standard rate of 2 children per 100,000 non-polio AFP (acute flaccid paralysis) cases.

      K.P. Sethunath – Deccan Chronicle Rise in Paralysis Cases After Polio Vaccine http://www.deccanchronicle.com/channels/cities/thiruvananthapuram/rise-paralysis-cases-after-polio-vaccine-234

      Delete
    8. Here's a good example of vaccine woo promotion, first create a demand with maybe if but could type associations. Then wind up on prime time or Tricia and then the market is ready. Next develop the product and then get the government to underwrite it just is case it doesn't work or worse kills people. Then claim that the outbreak that doesn't actually happen was because of the vaccine, and nuke any country that doesn't play ball. Read on:

      Health officials say the death of a 61-year-old Ohio woman is the first associated with a new swine flu strain.

      The Ohio Department of Health says the woman died this week. It says that she had other medical conditions but that the H3N2v influenza virus may have contributed to her death.

      She was not identified but lived in Madison County. She became ill after contact with hogs at the Ross County Fair.

      Federal health authorities report 288 cases of the strain this summer. The state health director says most of Ohio's cases have been mild.

      He's urging at-risk groups to avoid swine exhibits and take other precautions. Those groups include young children, older residents, pregnant women and people with weakened immune systems or other medical conditions.

      I mean how bullshit is this crap or what, I shit you not!

      Delete
    9. Well that's the end of the ham sandwich then, again.

      Why can't they invent politician flu then we could cull them all together, or NIH flu or CDC flu variant.

      Septic flu is paper pandemic, lots of little pockets of nasty infection all rambling about vaccine mythology and stories of milkmaids and lurgy whilst supping on burgers and waiting to die! Nice to see a vaccine for this so come on let's see some real effort.

      Delete
  2. If your campaign was to sit all parents down and read the full contraindications for vaccines it would be balanced. Thing is this isnt done so every doctor and nurse who just rolls up shirts and jabs the goop in is breaking every consent rule in the book.

    At least we know all the septics are getting jabbed and that's some consolation.

    ReplyDelete
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    1. Looks like nobody really reads this blog......

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    2. Well it's typical of people, however well meaning and sincere who are duped by the 'let's vaccinate everyone and save lives myth'. Often these sites are artificial constructs either by putting up a person to do it that has no idea what they are doing, a stooge who wants their head patting, or a group of 2 or 3 Septics do it and pretend they are mrs middle America.

      They give them all the contact/action info and sit back. Have you heard about Bill Gates variant Polio in India, it's a typical example of what happens with mass vaccination, the disease gets worse so they rename it and 'adjust' the diagnostic criteria so that the 'wild' type 'disappears' and the campaign is a success.

      They are also usually fishing fronts, trying to find the arguments against the woo of vaccination and then influence the evidence database to dismantle the point.

      Another tactic is to pretend to be either on the fence or interested in the debate, of which there isnt one, and try and find out who is not supportive of vaccine mythology and then do character assasination.

      They often dump 'my child is blind' in the middle of a discussion to pull the emotional card.

      Liz Ditz either doesn't exist or she is dead! Or they haven't got time to carry on the myth. When they realise that this site is now a great advert for why vaccination is bullshit it will disappear!

      Tell as many of your friends as possible to start posting on every thread with as much real evidence of the harm that vaccination is doing whilst there is time to properly inform anyone who comes across this rediculous site, you can just choose anonymous to post so it's easy.

      Delete
    3. Well, most of what you write is kind of funny or filled with logical fallacies. How about some peer-reviewed high-impact journal articles for your "Bill Gates variant Polio" in India. I'm not holding my breath, since I'm well aware of your sources, but I'm giving you a chance to provide real evidence. And I don't play the argument from ignorance game with anyone. Absence of evidence is evidence of absence. OK anonymous?

      Delete
    4. @ Anonymous: Doctors and nurse do screen patients for any medical contraindications and they also provide the VIS (Vaccine Information Sheet) to the patient/parent before each vaccine is administered.

      Providing of the VIS is a Federal law which is implemented by every State (check your State's health and education laws).

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    5. "Tell as many of your friends as possible to start posting on every thread with as much real evidence of the harm that vaccination is doing..."

      That will take about a nanosecond.

      Delete
    6. Ah, the slime crawls out to support the nonsense. Always the same guys/gals lumbering from site to site desperate to keep mythology going.

      Keep sucking Bill's Nob Shay, one day some of his money might go your way too!

      Delete
    7. Speaking of slime, Anonymous - how much choad are you partaking in?

      I mean, you're right - there's no debate regarding vaccinations. Not among rational adults - because the evidence is clear that vaccinations save lives.

      Delete
    8. Psalm 21 verse 3 'thou shout not diss vaccination as all those who doeth are not rational, the bible is clear vaccination is the only way to true healthness'

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    9. 9th commandment, Anonymous.

      Thou shalt not bear false witness.

      Which you have broken many, many, times.

      Delete
    10. What is this vaccine believer mantra, please explain. How can you read a vaccine efficacy data sheet, it says it's woo and then you convert that information into efficacy data! Is that your job Lilady to 'massage the stats?'

      Delete
    11. Renaming diseases to hide vaccine failure is standard issue for stats- Health officials convinced the Chinese to rename the bulk of their polio cases Guillaine Barre Syndrome (GBS).

      A study found that the new disorder (Chinese Paralytic Syndrome) and the GBS was really polio. After mass vaccination in 1971, reports of polio went down but GBS increased about 10 fold…….In the WHO polio vaccine eradication in the Americas, there were 930 cases of paralytic disease—all called polio. Five years later, at the end of the campaign, roughly 2000 cases of paralytic disease occurred—but only 6 of them were called polio.

      The rate of paralytic disease doubled, but the disease definition changed so drastically that hardly any of it was called polio any more.”

      You can read more of this dishonesty in the JAMA too:
      Peterson et al (Vaccination-induced poliomyelitis in Idaho. Preliminary report of experience with Salk poliomyelitis vaccine. JAMA; 159 (4): 241-244)

      Delete
  3. Michael Simpson "skepticism, photography, motorcycles, travel, food, iPhone, hockey, baseball," Brilliant septic sports prat into biotech! You are one of those mythmakers ie without genetically modified food we are all gonna die! How can anyone list an Iphone as an interest!

    I love my fellow Americans that just sing the flag every am, I suppose you subscribe to the Codex on food?

    This site is like an indenti kit septic tank, bring on the swearing lunatic please I can't wait!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. "Well that's a fuck up then,"
      Swearing - check
      "Liz Ditz either doesn't exist or she is dead! "
      Lunacy - check.
      Our swearing lunatic has been here from the start.

      Delete
    2. The blindness of the septic is all too apparent. Unable to read vaccine failure, unable to discourse and above all unable to accept questioning of the vaccine mantra. Say hi to the Pebbles and bam bam or the wode of truth, not long before it all falls down.

      Delete
  4. "peer-reviewed high-impact journal articles" what like the ones Rupert Murdoch's family sit on the board of!!!!!!!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. [citation needed], Anonymous

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    2. Peterson et al (Vaccination-induced poliomyelitis in Idaho. Preliminary report of experience with Salk poliomyelitis vaccine. JAMA; 159 (4): 241-244)

      Delete
  5. "Yes, India might stop the use of the trivalent polio vaccine. Now they're using the bivalent vaccine." Well that's a fuck up then, if they got it wrong massively the first time why should they get it right the next time? You guys are so believer in all this pro vaccine crap you can't even call time when they screw up!

    What did they baptise you with, Monsanto corn?

    ReplyDelete
  6. Could we just dispense with the vile language, Anonymous?

    How about, you know, providing some information based on science and the links to the sites you source from?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Peterson et al (Vaccination-induced poliomyelitis in Idaho. Preliminary report of experience with Salk poliomyelitis vaccine. JAMA; 159 (4): 241-244)

      Delete
  7. You can look it up yourself, if I invented a 'vaccine' that produced a worse disease than the one it was supposed to prevent do you think I'd get another go!

    So if 'Bill Gates variant Polio' is determined to be by 'other causes' lady pants let's see who says so!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. No, Anon, you made the claim. Now you back it up. How about some hard science to support your babblings?

      Delete
    2. Well let's play 'the other causes, but most definitely not the vaccine, I mean we are taught vaccines only save lives it's not possible that they take or ruin it......... in fact vaccines...........

      Most of your rhetoric reads like a party political broadcast Shayg, it's amazing how no one was posting on this blog, no supporters from the public it was supposed to lie to.

      A few people start pointing out how crass it is and every septic snake from every corner crawls over and it's a post fest!

      That says that really the whole thing is a dwindling winge, JOB DONE! really enjoyed seeing how pathetic the whole 'let's vaccinate the world' campaign is going!

      It ain't

      Delete
    3. So, where's the evidence you claim to have?

      Let's see it - you've made the claim, it's for you to substantiate.

      We'll wait. I'm sure you have a cut/paste of plagiarism handy somewhere.

      Delete
    4. I love this medical peer reviewed shit, you ask for evidence and imply it's got to be a babble. Didn't the church do the same thing about flat earths and vacuums?

      Your position is about as scientific as page 69 of the Karma Sutra, keep it up!

      "No, Anon, you made the claim. Now you back it up. How about some hard science to support your babblings?"

      Delete
    5. You can lobby for mandate on vaccine woo all you like, it's a democracy. But mandating for vaccination is like mandating that everyone has to go to church, you gotta be a blind faith believer to be a member.

      Getting Senators to give vaccination the nod is not about science it's about having friends in the right places.

      Asking for 'hard science' to back it up is a joke, it's like telling someone to look in the bible for evidence that God and Jesus didn't exist!

      Have you ever read PubMed or any elsevier peer reviewed medical journal?

      Delete
  8. So, no facts, so Anon falls back on attempting to attack the messenger.

    Again...if there is such a preponderance of evidence supporting your claims, Anon, why is it so difficult for you to come up with any?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. So if attacking the messanger is not ok why do you diss any website that publishes known data on vaccine failure as not credible? Is that one rule for medical peer review and one for others?

      Delete
    2. Peterson et al (Vaccination-induced poliomyelitis in Idaho. Preliminary report of experience with Salk poliomyelitis vaccine. JAMA; 159 (4): 241-244)

      Delete
  9. "Yes, India might stop the use of the trivalent polio vaccine. Now they're using the bivalent vaccine. So, you want India to have polio because you misunderstand how vaccines work?" Simpleton

    This is the kind of vaccine logic we are used to, the fact that mk 1 was a disaster means logically move to mk 2!

    This is believer nonsense, it is so impossible that vaccination doesn't work, kills children or doesn't do what it says that Mickey Mouse logic applies.

    This is why mandating vaccination is not in anyones interest, the supporters of it have had their critical logic suspended and the conflicts of interest have allowed media celebs to dictat health policy!

    It is also typical of these artificial debate constructs here that none of your target audience is supporting you at all, most of them find your methods that of a double glazing salesman, instinctively you are untrustworthy.

    I and a few others question your 'sauces' and you immeadiately freak out and call 'heretic'.

    At least you are a dying breed and to watch the septic movement pass into the toilet where it belongs is a joy, but it is taking too long!

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    1. Wow, Since when did 15% become a majority? I guess math isn't your strong point either. Well, mickey mouse logic might be though.

      Delete
    2. Oooh looks like Pooper misposted this from his porn site, can anyone tell us what it relates to?

      3/32 was the maximum number of people at the Common cold unit that could be 'infected' with a cold or flu virus in lab controlled RCT conditions. So that equates to 10%, apparently that was enough 'medical evidence' to mass poison the world and make us pay for it with something called vaccination!

      Delete
  10. "I mean, you're right - there's no debate regarding vaccinations. Not among rational adults - because the evidence is clear that vaccinations save lives." Ticktock

    Well now you are quoting the medico biblicus, mantra no? The only evidence that you can quote is from medical peer reviewed journals. It may have bypassed the average lab rat but that is like asking bankers for their opinion on the global finacial mess!

    Blinded by science yet again.

    There is no 'evidence' that vaccination does anything beyond add to the viral load that eventually has to be shed!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Most peer review journals are not medical and they all say the same thing. Plus, vaccines add to the viral load like a tear adds to the ocean.

      Delete
    2. Since when was playboy relevant to health care Pooper? It might be on a parallel to medpub but that's another story.

      Are you sure you aren't getting off on all this attention?

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    3. Do you even know what you are talking about?

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    4. The pooper drops his kacks in public again. The kind of guy that leaves the dunny with paper stuck on his foot and no one wants to tell.

      Delete
    5. Ah, more breaking of the 9th commandment from Anonymous.

      Delete
    6. Unlike you I have no idea about religious dogma, perhaps you could enlighten us Lilady, embarrassed and hiding now are we or run out of Oracisms, you are playing the game of the hunted mouse.

      Delete
  11. I mean, you're right - there's no debate regarding vaccinations. Not among rational adults - because the evidence is clear that vaccinations save lives. Tickertyboo

    Mantra number two is that only 'rational' people can debate vaccination because it is 'protected' by divine provenence, ie medical peer review. If thou shall commit heresy thou shall be excommunicated from the community of belivers!

    Ie Bill AB 2109 shall only discuss/project the word and only the word.

    ReplyDelete
  12. "So, where's the evidence you claim to have?

    Let's see it - you've made the claim, it's for you to substantiate.

    We'll wait. I'm sure you have a cut/paste of plagiarism handy somewhere."Tickingbomb

    Here we see the septic logic, requests for information and then a really clever move 'we know where you got it' This psychic type of thinking occurs in those who have gone through strong initiations and rituals, only a believer may stay.

    In summary, tell us what you know but if it doesn't agree with us it must be rubbish!

    This is medical logic as opposed to ordinary logic, quite interesting but on the whole leads to total tyranny and depression if dabbled in too long.

    ReplyDelete
  13. This is the mission statement on Liz Dutz's recommended reading! "Owners of sites linked to from here may be offended and feel that I am holding them up to ridicule by calling them arseholes." Nice one Peter, takes one to know one!

    ReplyDelete
  14. Note that I continue to allow Anon to babble. He (or she) has no evidence, so resorts to name calling.

    Citations, Anon, citations.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Anon writes like a 10-year-old, which is a greater maturity level than it's logic. I think it is good to let anon continue to post. It shows the world just what type of mentality it takes to be anti-vax.

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    2. Hoorah! Meanwhile all those kids with Narcolepsy in Finland from the swine flu vaccine have people like you to thank.

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    3. Liz there's no escaping and no one can aplogise except you for your lack of understanding. Are you ready to be forgiven?

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    4. Hey Liz, that's an old Oracism, you are playing the old switcheroo. Has it ever occured to you that getting the nod from a load of political arseholes is not actually a result or cool actually.

      You can pretend as much as you like that what you are doing is a public spirited and very Christian but it's actually a complete mis informed cock up.

      I cannot believe you have done any research on what you are doing, how many cocks have to hang out before you see it?

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    5. Please keep posing, Anonymous. Show the world how crazy you and the anti-vax movement is.

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    6. It is amazing how provaxxers can't see the evidence in their own literature, preferring instead to 'believe' in the woo.

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    7. Peterson et al (Vaccination-induced poliomyelitis in Idaho. Preliminary report of experience with Salk poliomyelitis vaccine. JAMA; 159 (4): 241-244)

      There are lots more than this Liz, but of course you will have seen them so you can move forward with an informed position, what's that you haven't read them oh dear then.

      Delete
    8. Listening to those opposed to AB 2109, what a joke, listening to the silence of no debate, have you run out of bullshit?

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    9. I think, judging from the sexist comments of the previous anonymous, as well as the passing of the law, that the hateful and anti-vax anonymous has not a shred of evidence to back up his/her/its claim and can only rely on bad science, ad hominem attacks, and blatant sexist comments for an "argument"

      At least he/she/it proved how hateful he/she/it really is, and that his caterwauling was for naught.

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